“王震宇”“王震宇控诉bigben446”话题唯一讨论帖

MiddleAgeMan

To: 大姐夫马甲

所以，你们也别忙着指责老王了。那没意义，老王继续用拉米，我也继续用拉米，等待更好的治疗方案就完事了，长远来说，恩替、拉米都要被淘汰。


We are not talking of your treatment plan. We are talking of people who first start antiviral treatment.

所以，你们也别忙着指责老王了。那没意义，老王继续用拉米，我也继续用拉米

It is meanful. We have the resposibility to inform first time HBVer that 老王's treatment plan is against the updated guideline. His plan will put antiviral naive patients on LAM, and LAM has a 70% (5 year) drug resistence.

MiddleAgeMan

To nwjk:

原来我怀疑王震宇，我通过深入学习他发表的《攻略》，现在我不怀疑他了，感觉他确实为乙肝的治疗作出了贡献。所以论坛上不应该排斥他。

现在我不怀疑他了, that is fine. That is your own opinion. 感觉他确实为乙肝的治疗作出了贡献, again, that is your own feeling. 所以论坛上不应该排斥他. You as a single person does not represents all 论坛.


Logic, again, LOGIC.

MiddleAgeMan

To nwjk:

真正的免疫耐受，应该是人的免疫系统对病毒一点也不认识，不对病毒产生任何的攻击。事实上，这样的免疫耐受存在吗？
即使这样的免疫耐受存在，病毒寄生在肝细胞，吸收肝细胞大量营养，也必然造成肝细胞营养不良，更不用说病毒会直接造成肝癌的可能

I suggest you to find some basic hbv paper to establish your hbv background.


即使这样的免疫耐受存在，病毒寄生在肝细胞，吸收肝细胞大量营养，也必然造成肝细胞营养不良(You really do not have the basic knowledge)，更不用说病毒会直接造成肝癌的可能

MiddleAgeMan

To 天行健君

拉米要400，阿德还只要200呢，阿德耐药比拉米低多了。
有人就是容不得主流意见，非得自己另外搞一套，还不容别人根据指南提出质疑，这是什么心态。
有些病友喜欢盲从，以为又出了个大救星，可是历史上所谓的大救星最后都被证明只是野心家而已，你们只是野心家手里的炮灰。

We are talking about if it is good (for the effectiveness of treatment, not the drug price) to use LAM as the first choice of antiviral treatment. We are not discussing the price of the drug. Please do not change the subject.

MiddleAgeMan

Repost:

To 坚强懦弱:

王震宇一直在探索，且不管他的治疗方案和什么指南有没有点冲突，但至少王震宇是在不断探索的

If I or my loved one go to a doctor, I want a consevative, proven medical treatment. I DO NOT want to be a first mouse to test some Dr. curiosity, not to say that his investigation is against the update guideline and appoved facts. 探索 should not(this is a typo) left to standard clinical trial, not for a single doctor, he does not have the ability, resource to do this kind of 探索.



The correct one:

To 坚强懦弱:

王震宇一直在探索，且不管他的治疗方案和什么指南有没有点冲突，但至少王震宇是在不断探索的

If I or my loved one go to a doctor, I want a consevative, proven medical treatment. I DO NOT want to be a first mouse to test some Dr. curiosity, not to say that his investigation is against the update guideline and appoved facts. 探索 should left to standard clinical trial, not for a single doctor, he does not have the ability, resource to do this kind of 探索.

清凉平常心

回复 大姐夫马甲 的帖子

这能说明什么问题？

cshbv

A lot of good logic by MiddleAgeMan. Bottom line:

Use the best treatment available. 拉米 is not one of them.
Yes, with 拉米, you have a chance. With better drugs, your chances are better.

大姐夫马甲

一个月没上来，发现来了一个MiddleAgeMan ，英文写了很多。其它我不多说，针对他的一句话说一下：
你已知拉米耐药五年６６％， 为什么不首选恩替（５年耐药３％).  拉米1年 hbvdna undetectable 51%. 恩替 1年 hbvdna undetectable 90%.

-----------------老兄，耐药只是药物副作用之一，药物会有很多不明的副作用，do you know?

MP4

1.无论中药西药都无特效治疗HBV的，但是西药可以抗病毒，中药可以抗纤维化。
2.免疫耐受，不代表免疫不作为，事实上C抗体就是免疫系统识别出C抗原的产物。