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肝胆相照论坛 论坛 学术讨论& HBV English 我国科学家开发出比Cas9/sgRNA更优的基因编辑系统 ...
楼主: newchinabok
go

我国科学家开发出比Cas9/sgRNA更优的基因编辑系统   [复制链接]

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发表于 2016-7-31 03:46 |只看该作者
业内大牛公开发邮件告诉同行们,都别继续花费时间和金钱去重复这个实验了。
韩春雨给世界挖了个大坑。

Email on ngAgo sent to the ISTT mailing list:

Dear colleagues,

the publication by Gao et al in May in Nature Biotechnology (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27136078) triggered an enormous expectation. This Chinese team led by Chunyu Huan reported that the Argonaute (Ago) protein from a rare haloarchaea, Natronobacterium gregoryi, (NgAgo) would efficiently work for gene editing purposes in human cells. Ago had been described as an DNA-guided endonucleases two years before, through a Dutch-Spanish microbiologist collaborating team (Swarts et al. 2014, Nature: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24531762).

On paper, the new (fourth) Gene Editing system looked great. An endonuclease, using ssDNA guides (5' phosphorylated though) and not RNA guides, without
a PAM, requiring 24 nucleotides (and not 20nt), hence with higher
specificity, and apparently with fewer off-target issues, since
modifications in just one position of the DNA guide resulted in >90%
decrease of the protein activity.

On paper.

I must confess we read the Huan paper in my lab with some disappointment,
after two years battling, unsuccessfully, with Ago from Thermus, through a
collaboration with my friend and colleague J. Berenguer, from the
neighbouring reserch centre CBMSO, and one of the co-authors of the Nature
2014 paper. We had been scooped. We repeteadly failed to find any gene
editing activity using Ago from Thermus thermophilus (TtAgo) in mammalian
cells, through a variety of conditions and we didn't understand why, though
we always suspected that these proteins would not be too comfortable at "toocold" temperatures as physiological +37C. After reading the Gao paper we
concluded we simply missed the right bug and congratulated them for being
smarter and lucky and for finding this archaea. Perhaps the trick was in
using NgAgo instead of TtAgo.

Shortly after NgAgo was released from Addgene, beginning of June, many labs,including mine, jumped onto it to try experiencing the anticipated great
expectations and joy associated with this new tool of prokaryotic origin.
But soon it was clear that something wasn't quite right. Rumours began
spreading during June and July at congresses, through social networks, list
emails and discussions groups that NgAgo didn't appear to work as reported.
Actually, didn't work at all. Some colleagues that I absolutely trust at
scientitic and technological levels started to indicate that they could not
reproduce Huan's paper results.

At the recent TAGC meeting (where IMGS was contributing to, merging in alongwith other Genetics Societies) Gaetan Burgio, from ANU, Camberra, Australia
, presented some very preliminary data with a gel with some intermediate
bands that would suggest NgAgo would be working and editing at the expected
places. But, shortly thereafter, Gaetan engaged his lab in an OpenScience
project, tried to characterize all these bands and.... found nothing. So,
again, another evidence confirming NgAgo is not working as a gene-editing
tool.

Gaeatan just released today his experience using NgAgo, openly sharing his
failures and providing details and some explanations for them.

My experience with Natronobacterium gregoryi Argonaute (NgAgo)
Gaetan Burgio
Group leader at JCSMR, ANU
https://medium.com/@GaetanBurgio ... h-natronobacterium-

gregoryi-argonaute-ngago-3ed8909b410c#.bo9y6mf9u

At first, KUDOS to Gaetan. Many thanks to him for sharing their efforts
trying to confirm some gene-editing activity associated with NgAgo. There isapparently none. In his view, NgAgo might be working as a ligase at
physiological conditions. Similar to our negative results using TtAgo it
would appear that NgAgo requires some higher temperatures to work as
initially reported. This of course seeds some doubts on the Gao et al.
publication and Gaetan, among other, is requesting to Nature Biotechnology
to request the Huan's lab to reveal and share their raw data. We will see
this part of the history how it develops...

But, now, the most important message to convey is: NgAgo does not work for
gene editing in mammalian cells. Be aware and do not waste your time, your
money, your peoople and projects. If anyone has any positive hint suggestingAgo is indeed working as a genomic editor, please share the results, for
the sake of Open Science, as Gaetan beautifully and most generously did.
Many thanks to Gaetan!

Unfortunately, this is a great disappointment. But, it also highlights the
uniqueness and the robustness of the CRISPR-Cas systems.

Long life to CRISPR!
最近论坛上救苦救难的大善人
咨询版的拉西大帝
他说拉米西斯精神依旧闪亮
删除所有反对言论,我很害怕!
都尿裤好几回啦!
今后你们大家别反对“拉米首药单药”
免得连累别的无辜战友倒霉

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发表于 2016-7-31 12:21 |只看该作者
有趣
到底谁是外行,哈哈
欢迎收看肝胆卫士大型生活服务类节目《乙肝勿扰》,我们的目标是:普度众友,收获幸福。
我是忠肝义胆MP4。忠肝义胆-战友的天地
QQ群搜"忠肝义胆孰能群"加入

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发表于 2016-7-31 12:43 |只看该作者
东霸天 发表于 2016-5-19 06:25
回复 齐欢畅2 的帖子

兄弟  我是不相信中国了  太失败了  乙肝这些药   恩替卡韦分散片   替诺福韦    阿 ...



中国应该是全球唯一全面研发生产拉米,替比,阿德,替诺,恩替,乙肝疫苗的国家了。
欢迎收看肝胆卫士大型生活服务类节目《乙肝勿扰》,我们的目标是:普度众友,收获幸福。
我是忠肝义胆MP4。忠肝义胆-战友的天地
QQ群搜"忠肝义胆孰能群"加入

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发表于 2016-7-31 15:33 |只看该作者
http://mp.weixin.qq.com/s?__biz= ... Khp3ZaBhUvYcbBld#rd

7月29日,来自澳大利亚、美国、西班牙等国的多位科学家公开表示,无法重复韩春雨NgAgo系统的基因组编辑结果,建议《自然-生物技术》(Nature Biotechnology)杂志介入,要求韩春雨公开原始数据。

此外,网上传有一封发给国际转基因技术协会会员的群发邮件说:“迄今为止,最重要的信息就是:NgAgo无法在哺乳动物细胞中进行基因编辑。看清楚,不要再浪费你的时间、金钱、人力和课题。如果任何人有任何线索表明Ago可以作为基因编辑器,请务必像盖坦·布尔焦一样分享这些结果。”
最近论坛上救苦救难的大善人
咨询版的拉西大帝
他说拉米西斯精神依旧闪亮
删除所有反对言论,我很害怕!
都尿裤好几回啦!
今后你们大家别反对“拉米首药单药”
免得连累别的无辜战友倒霉

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发表于 2016-7-31 17:33 |只看该作者
smilingcloud 发表于 2016-7-31 15:33
http://mp.weixin.qq.com/s?__biz=MzA3OTgzMzUzOA==&mid=2651224923&idx=1&sn=47339995f7dc8b5f68eb30c36f9 ...

难道是造假或者是数据错误?

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发表于 2016-7-31 18:11 |只看该作者
要真是中国人做出的这个东东是正确,那该多好啊!

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发表于 2016-7-31 19:49 |只看该作者
我相信韩教授的成果是真的!

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发表于 2016-7-31 20:51 |只看该作者
http://www.thepaper.cn/newsDetail_forward_1506540
多国科学家:韩春雨基因编辑实验无法重复,要求公开所有数据

7月2日之后,韩春雨不再有新的回复。7月4日,澎湃新闻(www.thepaper.cn)联系上韩春雨,他以“学校告诉我不要做任何回应”回绝。
有基因学家对澎湃新闻(www.thepaper.cn)表示,如果最终《自然-生物技术》杂志在介入调查后也认为韩春雨的实验是无效的,那么他在5月2日发表的论文将会被《自然-生物技术》删除。
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
国人好面子,如果是内部问题,多半会不了了之。

这次是世界范围内关注的研究技术,最终肯定会有一个明确的结论的。
日本的小保芳晴子的STAP细胞事件,大概用了1年时间才最终处理结束。

水落石出,不会很慢的。
最近论坛上救苦救难的大善人
咨询版的拉西大帝
他说拉米西斯精神依旧闪亮
删除所有反对言论,我很害怕!
都尿裤好几回啦!
今后你们大家别反对“拉米首药单药”
免得连累别的无辜战友倒霉

Rank: 8Rank: 8

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发表于 2016-7-31 21:19 |只看该作者
yelanglms 发表于 2016-7-31 17:33
难道是造假或者是数据错误?

之前有分析认为,韩论文中有数据反常规,疑似ps造假。
最近论坛上救苦救难的大善人
咨询版的拉西大帝
他说拉米西斯精神依旧闪亮
删除所有反对言论,我很害怕!
都尿裤好几回啦!
今后你们大家别反对“拉米首药单药”
免得连累别的无辜战友倒霉

Rank: 4

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发表于 2016-8-1 06:36 |只看该作者
这人被证明造假的话,又是赤裸裸的煽耳光,这个国家科学上的成就跟足球有得一比。
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